Sean O Sullivan | Gaelic Football | Kerry GAA

Sean O Sullivan | Gaelic Football | Kerry GAA

We are joined by former Kerry footballer Sean ‘The Bawn” O Sullivan on
We hear a stripped-back in-depth chat about Sean’s journey to winning four All Ireland Medals and the mentality required on and off the pitch to be successful.
Sean also tells us about his Personal Training company SOS Personal ( Training and his coaching career with the Kerry Development Squad.




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So here we are showing Oh, Sullivan. I didn't realize I have to say do my research for you. How many showing us opens the world the whole world? As it's a common name, isn't it? I thought it was just carry cart, but it seems to fail.



Yeah. Well, I know that. Not that I'd be googling myself very bizarre. But people that people have told me that there's definitely a snooker player. Because he actually he followed me on Twitter, believe it or not, and I followed him back and he sent me a DM I this is going back a couple of years ago. He's not probably one of the better known snooker players, but we just had a bit of a laugh on Twitter over it. So I know him. You came across another few words. Yeah, there



was it was a Dragon's Den. There's an investor.



Yes, that's right. I



think stronger as well. Yeah. I just don't know how you managed to put it all together. Where do you get the time?



Well, my bank balance certainly doesn't reflect.






I've heard of the Dragon's Den guy, right. But the astronomer knows his doesn't doesn't ring a bell. But yeah, look, obviously Solomon is a very popular name around these parts. During my carried ears. It was crazy. You had in that team of the naughties. You had Tom Sullivan, you had Darren O'Sullivan, you had Declan O'Sullivan, you were Charles Sullivan. So there was no shortage of them. So yeah, very popular down here. But still very easy to distinguish between our status and I can leave you be very easy.



I don't know about that now is that the postman has a few nightmares that I need any new postman coming in? I guess that's where the show unborn came from then. Is that is that some sort of identification?



Yeah, that's a funny one. Actually. I suppose it goes back to my my minor days. So most young fellows would have done their leave, and certainly could wait to head off to college. I was the opposite. Actually, I finished school rather early. I finished school at 17. And I just felt that college wasn't for me straightaway. So I I accepted my course in the MIT Limerick Institute of Technology, a business course. And but I deferred it for a year and worked in a local financial company here in in Florida, very famous company. No, actually Mexico. And I worked for the Western Union money transfer section of this. I had worked there during school anyway. And part time and on holidays was I accepted a full one year contract there before I headed to college. But I worked with a guy there, who for some reason, taught that the fact that bone rhymed with Shawn was was a pretty easy way to go. So he christened me, Shawn born and so that was my year of my I was a carry miner in 98. So it actually, you know, other fellows were coming into the carry miner squad common Street to training after secondary school or they had been home for dinner, and they were going off to training whereas I was actually working a full time job. So I think it was actually a pivotal year in my development, Jonathan, because it allowed me the flexibility of of, so I'd work say on a Saturday, and I get a day after in the week. So it allowed me arrested during the week, if you get me that most of the guys wouldn't have had because they're going to school, they have your barely for school where I had arrested. strength conditioning wasn't even really a big thing at that time. But I remember, you know, on my day off during the week, I get a little body with worked on that maybe other guys wouldn't have saw it really, I think looking back on that year where I took off college and and took the year off to work and it definitely brought me on physically and obviously you know, I was 18 so i was growing into a men anyway, but certainly I found that you're very beneficial in terms of getting fitter. I was doing an extra an extra bit of running work on my on my own that I wouldn't have been able to carry my inner So looking back at it, it was a good year for me but yeah, that work colleague of mine decided that Shawn Bond was a good one so and it's unfortunately in some some ways it's it's stuck has more nicknames. Well, judging by that dressing room alone, and you're lucky you didn't have names on the back of the shirts



because they kept none of it was three or four of you there but it is it is fascinating and even it's one of the things that I'd like to kind of, I suppose extract a bit more from you know, in this series of interviews that we're doing because look there's a lot of you know, interviews out there and what you're reading the papers and their various platforms and they're more shorter and it's more like you hear the news stories and opinion on on the news stories I'm just a bit more fascinated than to get inside. Inside the Mind really of a theory like if you're for time on Ireland, all Ireland winner I know that might be standard and carry but it's very much not the standard outside the carry. It's a it's a huge achievement and even it's fascinating to note even from your early days there like back Extra cup of Ron's have to do in those extra couple of rounds of circuits or whatever. Even at that stage where the game hadn't been as an advanced really in terms of it'd be different I'd say if you were doing if you were 18 now and doing minor train at the moment we'll discuss a bit more on that later on but even still you had that extra I need to do this extra couple of presenter get an advantage. Yeah, well, I'll



never forget one of those Saturdays that I was supposed to be working we had a challenge game with the miners and I had to get some time off work to go to us but I was coming back to work again after and one of the selectors was a guy called jr Murphy from Caribbean really, really good man. very experienced newbies football. And I remember CMD I This was one of the very early challenge games know when the year with the miners and I was struggling not from a liability point of view because I knew inside my own head that I wouldn't be in there if I didn't have the ability or if Charlie Nelligan who was the trainer at the time didn't see anything in me I wouldn't even have been close to it. But I did struggle fitness wise because you can imagine I was coming from a small rural club where there wasn't much emphasis on fitness it was just show up and play your game show up to a couple of training sessions during the week and that was really what I really struggled I think we played leash up in Limerick and anyway jr was dropping me back to work after Lincoln Arlen and as I was getting over the care he just grabbed me by the shoulder as I was getting older and he said you're gonna have to get fitter Shawn it's as simple as that you want to have to get fit where you will be left behind. And like I was you're talking about a minor team that's included tight Kelly on Brosnan miracle she it no matter how many so you were looking around the dressing room obviously you know tyreke had already played minor here before but when you're building carry in European minor football you hear of the magical shears and you hear of the on Brazilians and these days and I was looking at these photos and they were a lot stronger fitter than me and I've allowed myself going into back into work that day I said I'm just gonna have to do something about this. So that was why I dedicated those extra days I head off to just getting getting fitter, it Robert aerobically fitter, Jonathan, it wasn't so much that I had to be this big beast of a man familiar football, but I just needed to get a Robic Lee fitter, and I just worked hard on this and they knew I just knew that the amount of talent inside in a 2530 man carry minor squad. And if I didn't do that, then as jr said, I was going to be left behind because there was another guy there ready to step in and take my place, you know. So I worked hard on this and I would have been very, very quick speed would have been a huge asset of mine. So I didn't worry about that it was just more long, long distance enduring stuff that I needed to get better at that I wasn't running out to guess, you know, at half time or maybe 40 minutes into a game which was that that was you know, it was happening. So once I got my head around that I you know, I made my mark with the minors and I ended up having a decent year even though we lost to the aforementioned leash in the all Ireland semi final in Croke Park, but I knew that I had gotten myself to a fitness base and and played well, and that I could drive on from there. But you know, I just took that little bit of a clip around the ear from from a selector to say, Listen, if you don't change this, it's it's not going to work for you. And I'm so glad he did.



It's almost like the light switch moment that we're I suppose mentally it probably got you're better prepared as well. You probably didn't know what at the time but definitely probably got you more focused on the on the zone Really? If you want to call it



absolutely, absolutely. And it's not like I was living a bad lifestyle or anything. I was living in a dorm I was walking in the next town over. You know, Knights elves were few and far between, you know, you were you're a young fella still, obviously, you know, going out and experimenting with the social side of things should I say? I bought at the back of my mind it was always carry football, always, always carry football. And look, it even got to a selfish point of view. And I missed, you know, friends birthdays. girlfriends or girlfriend wouldn't have been too happy with me at the time. But it was it was just pure and utter carry football. It's funny, actually. You know, I was on it the other day. I suppose just to give you a scene of what it's like down here like maybe more smaller places. I have my parents living next door to me. I have my sister on one side and my brothers across the way and my parents recently moved into a new house and my brother moved into the old house across the road and my mother was clearing up and she found some scrapbooks that she would have kept up my my earlier days and I just happened to flick through them the other day and at the back of one of them was just a page dedicated to me as a smart fella. So you're talking 567 years of age, and I was in nothing but a carrier outfit. I mean, not even just the jersey. I mean you're talking socks pulled up to the sharks the whole lot. There wasn't pitcher in the pitch you're on the page where I wasn't in a carry kit. So, it was always it was there it was I always wanted to play for carrier and that little bit of a talking term as you said that that that little bit of a I suppose the the light bulb moment from from that selector was was huge huge and from there on in it was just one way I was going and and that was to train and play for carry as many times as



I could it's probably a difficult question for you to to answer but it's something I know I'm personally fascinated by like you obviously you grew up in you grew up in Cary, which is the kingdom of football and you would have seen just all Ireland after all Ireland after Ireland which you probably wouldn't get.



Well, well. No, I didn't because if you think about us, and I was born in 1980, okay and carry bead Roscommon and easy and the forestall Ireland. I remember watching well, half watching actually was 1986 against Tyrone. And if you remember that Ireland, Tyrone absolutely dominated carry in the first half and things were looking very, very bad as half died. My mother and father were at the game. So my grandmother, the rest are my father's mother was looking after us. And I went in behind the couch at halftime and I wouldn't close, I just would not come out. And all of a sudden I think it was possible and scored a flying goal. He flew through the air and punched the ball into the net. And there was a big help from my grandmother and slowly but surely. I was like a Meerkat I was sneaking. In Mikey, she scored a great goal to turn the tide for Carrie. So that was my last I learned and seen Carrie when Jonathan and I sat and I still in the canal in 97 with a big meal. It's just fascinating, though, doesn't know like,



I guess it's more than the names that you're Romanoff, then maybe a little error prior to that. But you're definitely growing up in a in a county that's football match and has a serious culture of winning.



Crazy Crazy and that's why that famine is inadvertent commas which is which was for us in Cary was just so difficult to take year after year. And I mean, my memories of going to into clarity and up to par qui with my father and my my late uncle, who would have been a big influence on my career, my talk about him later, but and seeing Maurice Fitzgerald kick 1011 pints and still end up on the losing team, you know, driving down that old road from cotton down to carry again, you know, it was just it got harder and harder to take. And I mean, we did have a few, there was a few delays, you know, they won in 91. And again, when party or shear came on board, then they started to turn things around. But it was it was it was tough to take until of course 97 and and that went over me or kind of started stack to the to the golden generation again of carry teams. I think it all started really in 96 with that under 21 team will be Kevin and Thomas even I was at that game. And to win that on the 21 final for carry was absolutely massive like it was because you knew like I was only 16. But you knew that that was your next crop of seniors. And that these guys had the ability to, to possibly instead of living your weight on our own and then the following year they digital.



Well, if that's a farm, and I'll show you some farmers high standards, probably it probably proves the point. I'm trying to say but do you think there's any difference between a young lad grew up football obsessed, you've described the photographs as the five year old, fully decked out. And I'm sure there's if there was if there was more smartphones, etc. Around the time, they'd be booking loads more photographs, it was the sound of a kid that grew up football obsessed and had one dream, one you wanted to fulfill. Do you think that's the only difference though from somebody say just up the road and can declare and obviously there's Harlan there as well. But you know, other counties are what makes difference? I'm just curious to see. Because I obviously location is a certain factor. But what, what's what defines the difference? Really? Can you explain that?



Look, a lot of people will obviously point to tradition and Ducasse as they call it down here. And there's been been a lot of problems with the boulders and so on. And of course, it is it is tradition has to count for something and it counts for a lot. And I think a lot of it has to do Jonathan with just the the line of development, you know, what, what is each county doing? You know, to, to read the talent, you know, the kids are gonna pick up a bar. It's not I mean, it's, you know, I mean, you put a ball like three young fellas here at home, you put a ball in front of them, they're gonna pick it up, they're gonna kick it, they're gonna do something with it, you know? But, you know, where does it go from there? You know, where we At what age they start going up to the local field just kicking around, if there is talent in them hoes that harness to the club, and if they're one of those players that maybe makes it to the next level, you know, where does he go? Where is he? He's a very good under 14 1516 minor. Where's his next step? Is their development squad systems? So every county, okay, they're not they're going to have it in different numbers. Of course they are depending on as you said, location and the geographical aspect of things. But even if the numbers are small or big, where's the next step for them? And where is the next phase? And I think that's where Kenny you get it, right? Carrie, you get it? Right? Obviously, Dublin are getting it right now. And look, we can go into the money side of things there if we want to, but again, I'm very slow to, to come down and Dublin in terms of money, because it's finally and having the money, but you have to spend the money correctly, and you have to get the right people, you know, coaching and developing these players? Well, that's where the the counties that I've just mentioned God had, right and that's where they reap the rewards from in terms of their their success. You know, you mentioned a county like Claire, you know, there's been some very good footballers out to clear, and I'm sure there was probably many more, but where was the next step for them, you know, was what you know, was that line of development there in clear to bring these guys and girls to the next level? Obviously, Harling plays a big part there. Of course it does. So maybe the lines of development were focused on hurling non football, you know, and, you know, a team like Clara County, like Claire, there'll be a one day in the sun for them. And obviously, they got their day in 92 when they be caring, but those days won't be replicated because it was a flash in the pan. The system just wasn't there to sustain it. Whereas in carrying Kinney, you have your schools, you have your development squads, and that's that's where it comes from. So it's it's hard to explain why you know, carry is regarded as the home of football or to Kenya is regarded as the home of hurling. But when you delve actually interest it's it's it's they're really important to you. It's they spend so much time and quoting these roadmaps for want of a better word. It's the buzzword at the moment. For for young footballers and hurlers that they're not just maybe, you know, they get to a certain point in their career. And it's like okay, well just Hardaway or football way play football, there's that there's an end, there's an end game to us. And, you know, throw it throw in that in with a lot of it has to do with your, your family like, you know, I we were just still a man about football here, there was nothing else to do really. And, and from a young age, I was off the bat kick on my father a kick with my uncle. And that's how you developed a love for it. And then all of a sudden, you're you're into the you're on the way to the club, and it takes off from there. But it's, it can be explained sometimes it's hard to explain to people why why these places are so embedded in football, hurling whatever it may be. But when you actually dig deep down into us, it's not because it's set up for you to go on, if you have the ability, and if you have the commitment, you know, yeah, we'll look you've actually educated me



a lot there on that last couple of minutes. But just thinking as well, like you've got that I won't say clip across the year from the selector at the time coming back to work. And he obviously was a huge influence in your career. It sounds like as well, judging by what you said, your family's well there must have been a big influence on your personal and your footballing career.



They were Yeah. My father would be a quiet man, he would never he would never have, you know, you know, been roaring shouting at me at games or telling me what to do or the other thing. I think one vivid memory stands out to my father ever really having a stern ward in my year was I was playing with actually, I think it was around the time of the Korean miners I mentioned earlier about high scores at 17 and 18. Jonathan, you know, we've all been there you your head gets turned maybe for a night out or something like that. And I would have been usually pretty good. But there was one particular night where I accepted a friend's invitation to go into Florida for a night out and I was late getting home but we were playing a challenge match the next year with the minors against the carry junior team actually. And my father was given the job of driving into the game and home again, it usually would have been my mother. I'm not sure why he was he was given the job when I was absolutely shambolic. And it's not like I was home over or anything. I actually was very well behaved the night before but it was a late night and we didn't get home till two or three o'clock in the morning and it Just everything I did in that game was wrong. And the drive home was a quiet one right on the on the chart here and Come on, actually, we're just up the road. And just as we turned down the road, he said, Look, I'm only going to say this once he says, you can do what you did last night and try and play football The next day, it just doesn't work like, you know. And he said, I don't want to know what you're drinking. It's not, I don't want to know that, but you just can't do it. And again, similar to the carry minor selector, it was a lightbulb moment like that, you know, said, Listen, if you want to compete, as you know, I had, I had dreams planned for the carry seniors and I, I was I could hardly keep the ball straight. But the reminders I mean, where was I gone? You know, and what it was, again, it was a moment where I said, if you want to get anywhere near where you feel you can go, you're going to have to make a few adjustments in your in your life, you know, and what he would have been very quiet, my own capacity would have been a lot more, I suppose, you know, we all have they don't know who he is. He's not, he's not your dad, would he



get away with saying a bit more?



Exactly, exactly. He's a very, very close second. And he would have been a lot more into where I can improve. Like, he was the first man who said that I really needed to go and practice with both feet in I ended up taking that advice, saw onboard so much that I'd actually don't, he was probably got stronger off my left foot than my right foot, you know, and he was the guy who, you know, he spent a long time in America. So he would have seen, he would have taken a big interest in the NFL, I think I mentioned to him before, he was already a jet Jets fan. And so he would have been bringing the love back of you know, getting the body raisins, you know, walking on your overhead catch, and going up to the field with the balls and kicking up the horse, he would have been big into this, you know, whereas my father wouldn't have been showing that advice at me. But anything he said, was still, you know, very much very much to the point and taken on board. So they were they were and they were the two guys who as I mentioned earlier, I would have been traveling up to cork, you know, to see carry play a car can park we've we would have got open cork and had our tea and or sandwiches, like I'm sure you did as a young resolutely and got into the game and hoped hoped against hope that that carry would eventually win. And you more often than not, unfortunately, during that period, we'd come down with our tail between our legs. But that wouldn't stop you from going again The following year, you know?



Absolutely. And just another small thing I like the carry, I suppose clubs set up on the way the championship setup always seems a little probably perfectly normal to you guys. But it always comes across. A little strange to me. But just on that. Do you think like, obviously you you from a rural kind of response club in commander? Do you think that your club bearing has like you always hear the stories about or people from the county champions or the bigger clubs get picked? And it's easier for them to make development squads, minors under 16, minor squads, etc? Do you think that can be an impact, obviously, because the one thing that struck to mind is it seemed to have a very close knit coordinate and set up there even your clubs Twitter page mentions you and Danica Walsh has been their club are sorry, I'll learn winners, and you can see how much that means. Do you think that has an impact girl growing up? Or what are your thoughts on that?



Well, I think I think the important thing for me growing up was and I think it's a crucial thing. And Carrie, you hit the nail on the head that you whatever clothes come from, shouldn't be a factor on whether or not you you pay for carrying. And I think carry have proved that. I mean, you know, you can go through even that great squad that I was lucky to be part of in in the Nazis. You know, I mean, that there was there was guys stretching the length and breadth of the country. You know, and, and more importantly, you know, stretching the length and breadth of the country League, which would be, you know, our mean, it wouldn't be our main competition down here. But it's a good barometer of where your club sits in terms of the pecking order and carry football should I say. So. I mean, I come from a club and dunnock has come from a club that we've bounced between division five and for for, for since I played command senior, we've never gone higher. And I mean, that's gone back to I mean, I played when I was 16. So going back to 1996. You know, you have guys like Declan O'Sullivan, who would have again been down in division for a long time with dramat you know, Declan, in fairness, they got a good crop of players together and they pushed up the divisions. Kilian young would play with Renard again, bounced between four and five for as long as I can remember. So, it just goes to show you that it doesn't really matter which Are you where you're playing or football use if you're good enough, and you're, you're committed enough and you can play for carry, absolutely though, I would overdose, it helps, it definitely helps if you can get on to the college championship shot window. And obviously, for me to do that are for delicate to do this command on play in the county championship. So we obviously amalgamates with five other clubs and clear for me to carry which would be our divisional team. And, and I have no doubt that it was probably through there, that, you know, we would have been seen in a culture championship setting and the county championship can carry is is is a really good as I said shop window for the carry management and selectors to see who's out there. But again, a lot of it has to come down to maybe how you've performed through the levels coming up. You mentioned development squads, they weren't a huge thing when I was younger, they've obviously got a lot more better and and and more serious. I was involved with them myself for about seven years. They're they're a fantastic stepping stone for your players. And good. If you were lucky to come through onto a very minor squad and then under 21 squad, you were making a name for yourself as you went along and carry seat carry senior managers and management. We're always keeping an eye on on doors, you know, but it's it's a great, it's a great thing and carry that. You know, I'm from Milan, I had nobody before me as such we did have, we did have links to carry teams. Way back before our our club was only officially formed in 1983. So I had normally trailing a blade or blazing a trail for me, should I say in terms of making a senior county team? So a lot of I took a lot of pride actually. Sorry, I take a lot of pride with now at the time I really wouldn't have been taken which nordeste doors things because you're so in the moment and you're so right, I played Carrie minor. What's the next step? You're not looking back now actually, at 40 years of age, you know, you, you get a great sense of pride that you weren't the first commandment to play for the Kerry miners on a 21 sR tenotomy. And then, of course donica came along and, you know, I suppose in a way, and myself and Dominic have spoken about this, it helps don't again, we're not that he wasn't going to make us because he was sensational under each player always, always was going to pay for carry, what it helped that maybe I had done before and put the name of C'mon out there a little bit, you know, it was that to a certain extent. Exactly. And it just proved that just because we were a division five team who played Junior Championship football, doesn't mean we can produce 200 winners. You know, and I think that, you know, that should really be the template all over the country. Again, going back to your point about the geographical side of things, you know, smaller counties will obviously have to pick from smaller, you know, numbers and, and, and, and clubs, but certainly in carry, it's a case of if you're good enough. You know, it doesn't matter where you're from, if you can offer something you will play and I think that's what we proved, certainly,



certainly, but I suppose for me, I think I touched on there that the Karis club setup and then the way you've had sort of divisional, it confuses me from the outset. But when you broke it down there, and actually, it makes a lot of sense. And, you know, you've given the opportunity for people from you know, rural teams, smaller teams are now on the shop window, as you said, so it gives a big opportunity because sometimes we're all guilty of it from from looking in from Brazil, what are those lads done there, but they're not just do a normal club championship where each one plays at each other. But when you lay down there's definitely a lot of pros for it, isn't there?



Well, there is because, I mean, if if I didn't if if I didn't have my my divisional board team Macquarie, playing at such a high standard in the county championship, you know, I would we wanted in 2008 I would never have had a chance to win a college championship because C'mon would have had to climb up through Junior intermediate senior winner senior before you can even contemplate you know, going on your own in the county championship, which is never going to happen. And look on the flip side of that, you know, take a team like Dr. Crooks who have dominated the carry county championship in the last decade and a half probably you know, okay. So if they are producing top quality players who are producing a year in euros on a college championship level, and of course they should be in the carry setup. I mean, and and you go to the doctor croaks, and I want to use in crocs here as an example. You know, you go to the doctor, doctor, Crux players who have represented Kerry in the last 10 years. I mean, column Cooper on Brosnan, Johnny Buckley, right up to present Dr. Gavin white Mihail burns. These guys are all these guys are quality footballers. You know what I mean? It's not because they're from Dr. Crooks and they want to call the championship, it helps. Of course it does. But for me, it proves that they can do it at the highest level. And they're all match winners, they've all produced it. year in year out, they must have five or six county championship medals. I don't know how many chairs I'd say he, he's lost count at this stage. But they've proved that they can do it. So if they can do it at that level, of course, they should get a shot with carrying, you know what I mean? It's, I don't get that arguments. You know, that's odd, because they want the county championship, they're automatically brought in, and it doesn't work like that. Yes, they've won the championship, they've won the county championship, because they're good players. And if they're good players at the highest level within the county, then by all means they should be given a chance, at least inside and in a county setup. And those guys have proved that they're even beyond that. And they can go on to even higher level. I mean, you know, column Cooper on brazing. These guys, they've, they've all proved that. You know, if they had come from another club in the county, absolutely, they would have made it anyway, they would have made it anyway, you know, very true.



I suppose. To keep keep I can't go past your Club career without mentioning you're probably gonna kill me for saying this your age, and you're still playing the James Miller of the setup or something as



well. Did I mention I had three young fellas here, Jonathan. So you know, you need some you need some oklet to get out of the house? No, look, I suppose. Totally put it. Yeah, like I'm 40 since January, but I look, I'm knocking on wood here in front of me. I was very, very lucky that. Throughout my career, I had no serious injury. Really. I mean, I had your usual I mentioned my case earlier being a huge my biggest asset, really, there was the hamstring problems that come with having fast twitch muscles and doing a lot of sprints, you know. But nothing ever, ever too serious. quad muscle injuries may be the biggest injury I ever had was I broke my ankle in a club game a week before my wedding, believe it or not, so I was on crutches for my my big my big day. But anyway, the lesson about that as



long as they could, can



we push you on that.



And it was just one of those things I I had to play. If it were if it had been a county league game, I probably would have left this but it was a it was a championship match with clubs. So I had to play. But I know Mary taught me going out the door to my face for the autographs the following week. And of course, my face was fine. But I learned this from the back of a friend's car with crutches. She thought it was a joke at first. And what my point is that the body has body hasn't suffered a loss. And you know, I suppose I look back at my career career to Jonathan. And unfortunately, I didn't maybe rack up as many games as I would have liked to. I did. I did play quite a few games and came on as a sort of a lot of games. But unfortunate. There was a lot of games where I didn't see action. So even though I was doing full seasons of training, I wasn't putting up the mileage in games that maybe I you know, I would have liked to. So when I came over to my carry career, I was still relatively generic, but from my personal life in the tank still. Yeah. And I wasn't like I wasn't fed up with football. You know, I see some guys coming over their intercounty careers, and they don't go near the club, because they've just they're either they're fed up replan, or they've won whatever they wanted to win. And that is what No, I I always I always felt that when my dad did come to walk away from carry that I was going to go straight back in with mine and cliff, my mentor is clear to my body tells me that I can't do it anymore. And so far, it's been all here and I've had a few Wake Up Calls. Alright, senior training because we've we've a good bunch of young lads after coming through in the last two years and I think there was we did carry miner last year actually Kieran O'Sullivan really good player. Lovely, very strong, very fast. And, and of course, he can play with us this year. He couldn't play with us last year because it was genius. So I think in one of his force training sessions with the club this year, he he didn't have any respect for SR rz. And when he blew me over the sideline, he taught me an over the fence on the side of it. And I said to myself, Jesus, maybe it's about time I started thinking of walking away from this but, you know, I drove down in the car after and I was thinking No, you know what, that's great. That's great. That's that's exactly what you want. And it's and I've often said this to the to the fellows that have come through its doors guys that are driving me on to keep going because in a way, it from a selfish point of view, Jonathan, I hope that they can I was to success because that's why we play at the end of the day you want to, you want to win something. And so hopefully we do, but I keep going as long as I can. And the other side of it is where, as I keep saying, We're from a small place, it's not like we have an abundance of numbers or players. So as long as I can keep offering something, I'd keep going. And, you know, it's another body of training as far as I'm concerned. And you know, if the deal will eventually come where I can't, and you will miss it when you can. So I just keep going as long as I can.



Very good. Well, look from your, I suppose your day job as well. I know everything is a little contrary contained, as we speak with the restrictions slowly but surely, starting to ease off but the fact that you know, in your your day to day business life as well, your personal trainers are like, you can't really be given advice to people go do it, go do it. If you're going to say no, I'm going to sit and sit on the couch for the evening. Yeah.



Yeah, well, I look, I don't think even if I give up football, I want to, you know, step away from trying to look after myself, you know, it's, it's, and look, I'm a very much I love the Personal Training, I love I love. I just love working with people, I look, I'm a people person, I love working with people. And it has been difficult actually, since the COVID came along. I mean, the zoom sessions are great, don't get me wrong, but you know, they just lacked that, you know, that that personal touch, and but, you know, I'm a big believer in small, little small, little changes can make a big difference. I mean, you'd love to see somebody improving and reaching their goals. But you know, you also have to let people know that, you know, to reach those goals, you don't have to turn into an absolute fanatic about us, you know, what I mean, you can, you can get to where you want to be slowly but surely, I think people sometimes score over the top when it comes to, you know, getting fit and running and trying to be in impeccable shape. Whereas, you know, sometimes you just have to take it, you have to believe in the process and follow it nice and slowly. And, you know, I don't think, you know, when I do retire, that I ever stop not looking after the body, but at the same time, it's very important that you don't get obsessed with this type of stuff, you know, and, you know, I see some people coming to me, and they want results yesterday to get me and you're trying to you're trying to hold people back and say, Look, this is this, this isn't gonna happen overnight. But when when you do get to that place, and it's a journey, you're with them with them on a journey, like, you know, you, you have everyone from you know, Garrett's or wanting to lose pounds to fit into their wedding dress, you have, you know, people who just have let themselves go over the years because they're, you know, in desk jobs, or they just, you know, they've had busy personal lives with families, and they're just maybe forgot about themselves a little bit, you know, so you have everyone coming in the door. And most recently, I suppose, maybe in the last couple of years for me, which has been a big, big bonuses that you're getting, you're getting footballers coming to you, and they're in their offseason, you know, and I mean, the fact that I can stand with them as a personal trainer, but also as a guy who's gone through what they're going through is a huge, huge bonus for me, you know, so? Well yeah, it has it's been it's been tough. We saw myself in a major mine and Jerry coffee. We both run two different businesses sort his his his his businesses, his own, and my businesses, my own SOS personal training. And when we walk over the same unit, if you get there, and we we came across an old rolling clubhouse, believe it or not, not too far from here, and just outside Florida, and I'm sure a lot of elbow grease and cleaning and hoovering and obviously invested a bit of money. And we just turned it into a it's not it's not state of the art job and by any means, but it's good results as it does. And it's it's a real, it's a real kind of,



obviously, there's



a good feeling about the place, actually, you know, it's, it's, it's not falling down around us either, believe me, it's a fine building, or it's, you get in there and you just you know, you, you know that you you're gonna sweat and you're gonna put up, you're gonna put in a good hours work with us. And we don't run it as a normal daily gym. We're not there from eight o'clock in the morning till eight o'clock at night, which suits both of us because we'd be on families. But basically, if you want to do a session with me, you booked me and I meet you there and we design your plan and we we design your block of training, it's so it's it's a real personal, you're getting a real personal one on one. We do small group sessions as well. So if you want to meet three or four minutes wanted to come we have the room to do to do sessions like that, too, but I'm enjoying it. But yeah, since the COVID came along, it's been it's been hard and I've kept Maybe a few clients on that wanted to do the zoom doesn't suit everybody. You know, it's difficult with people with families, especially working from home and stuff like that they find it hard, but I've been keeping keeping up to date with the zoom sessions, but look, hopefully, you know, with with restrictions easing a little bit, it'll, it'll allow us to get back at some stage, although with social distancing, in case it's hard to see how our industry, you know, can can can go forward, but we're hoping that there'll be light at the end of the tunnel at some stage so we can get back at it.



Fingers crossed for you guys. Yeah, because I'd imagine all other businesses probably similar to your your, I suppose your mental career through intercounty levels, as well as the same, a lot of similar pressures involved, particularly when you're doing the such a personal service where you are, you know, you also work or you can give examples from you know, you even going back to the silly example of you've been told you need to do an extra bit compared to running from your, from your minor trainer, you can give insights you you've been there done that you've won a lot of battles and wars, although you don't get to play as many high profile games as you did without being streetwise to come around. So do you feel like your intercounty career is a big help to you in this environment?



Definitely. Definitely. Yeah, absolutely. You you, when you, especially when you're working with the footballers, obviously, but you put you know, your, your soap on the street as well, you know, you, you you you know, the the thing about a personal trainer, Jonathan is we can all go on train, listen, you cannot, you can all go on train on your own, and you can get a program and you can do X, Y and Zed. But I think a lot of people out there and that's that's where we come in as trainers is that the motivation, you know, and having that person, as I said, on the journey with you, who's there next to you. And, you know, sometimes as a personal trainer, you become way more than just a trainer, you become a psychologist, nearly, you know, because that person could have come straight from work, and might have put down an awful day of work or something might have happened. And they might even load on to you what's happened in, you know, they might be given out about a workplace in the middle of trying to get their bench presses don't do not mean and you're trying to, you know, balance all that. But it can be great fun at times, but particularly with the footballers, you know, I could be working with a footballer on a Monday morning who came in after paying a stinker the day before. Do you know what I mean? And the last thing he wants to hear about is a with our alone shoulder squat, you know what I mean? So you're there for them. And you, you know, Jesus, I paid money, a stinker, you know, so you're just basically trying to get them through that and say, listen, the beauty about football is that there's a game again, next week, you know, are any any little nugget at all you can give them just to opt in for the session and what your aim is, by the time they're finished with you after the 45 minutes or the hour that they walk out the door in a better place. That's that's all you're trying to do. And that can be hard. But you know, it's it's, it's, it's part of, of the, of the role that you play. And I I take I take I enjoy that part of it, actually. And, of course, then you have the guy that's after kicking 10 pints the day before and he immediately tell you how to run the session. Yeah, no, it's good. It's good. I enjoy it. You know, it was a complete, I walked in the bank for 13 years, you know. So when I decided to change tech, and I took redundancy back in 2014, our first son had been born. You know, I left my job just as our first son had arrived



on time and wasn't it?



Yeah. Well, you broke



your ankle before the week before you went and yeah, I know you did this after the first one.



Yes, I know quite a bit. Because I do when I give up, give up a nice pensionable job to go off of my own boss. I don't regret it. I don't regret it because I didn't see myself sitting at a desk, filling out mortgage applications. Just it was fine. While I was there, don't get me wrong. I enjoyed my time with the Bank of Ireland's what Colonia for the majority of my career there and I must say, brilliant, brilliant company to work for and really, really supported me in my football career. And anything I ever needed for them to be a time off or challenge games or switching my holidays around to go on training camps. You know, they were very, very obliging, but it came to a stage where I wasn't happy and I was coming home to Mary here in the evening times and I just I wasn't happy and she said one she just said one evening, what do you want to do? And I said, I want you know, I just want to do something in the fitness industry. I just feel that's where my future is. And they were giving out redundancies at the time I took us and Ryan was born in December of 2012. I left the bank in January 2013. And I was up and running as SOS personal training the following up After doing my course and listen, it's it's not that I'm, you know, this top well known trainer I have made a nice little client base that adds in now and again and loses a few now and again for different reasons. But it's it's what I enjoy doing and there's been very few evenings where I've come home or came back from training three or four people in raw to marry in bad form. So I think that really sums it up really



I'd like to dig a bit more into the I suppose your playing days would would carry on and senior level look, you touched a little bit on it there in terms of your work at the bank being so flexible with you and all that. How how, suppose you probably noticed that a develop on through through your careers are probably got more and more extreme. How difficult is it to be a full time intercounty footballer which you probably more than likely are to juggle that with family or relationships and work as well. It's it seems like it's something that got more difficult over the years. Yeah.






well, family wasn't an issue for me because I obviously I wasn't I didn't have kids and I was playing and and to be honest with you, I I don't I scratch my head sometimes. There was there was nobody in our setup I think that had children, maybe few the older fellas, were just having their first kid when when they were retiring. You know? What I looked there at somebody like Kieran Donaghy, who won the allowance in 14 played and 15 and he had a kid you know, Declan O'Sullivan had young children at home when he was commented you know, in his in that last year in 14 I I don't know how they did this, to be honest with you, Jonathan, because I left in I left in our nine. I'm sorry, I retired after you're not in Ireland, but they actually went back in and jack O'Connor was in charge. And going back to the club setup. And Carrie, I had a good county championship campaign with mid carry in 2011. And jack asked me back in for the staff to the league in 2012. And you know, if I have any regrets, it was actually going back in. I had just joined the Kerry miner team as a selector. Under Miki net or Sullivan in general Keith was there. And I was I was enjoying us. I was enjoying us. And when jack rang for me to come back into this seniors I deliberated about, and I eventually ended up going back in so I had to give up my my minor role, which actually has look what happened was taken by Peter Keane, who's obviously the current or current senior manager, but had a great a great run with minors as manager himself. And if I had any regrets, I was doing this because I went back in I played the first few league games Actually, we played Dublin, we played our mat. Okay, I didn't feel I was, you know, out, you know, I didn't look out of place I did, okay. And what, I just felt something I remember going to dinner after the game, down in the local hotel and truly played on the lights on a Saturday evening, and I was sitting at a table with a bunch of the younger carry guys, so I wouldn't have known. These fellas, really, for my time. They were all new into the setup since I had left. And absolutely nothing about the fellows that are at the table with me, but I just felt there. And then that I wasn't, it wasn't right. It wasn't racing. So I remember driving home with the car and I rang Mary from the hands free. And I said no, I've made a mistake here. And in fairness, I rang jack the next day and explained to him that it just didn't feel I just didn't feel that this was for me. And he took it on board and and I walked away from it for good this time. But my point being that I had left in or named Jonathan, and I had gone back in two years later. And even the difference in that two years to what was expected of you, as a senior intercounty footballer, was phenomenal. It was just phenomenal. I mean, the whole setup had changed. I mean, you were doing, you know, you were doing so your your week was, you know, Monday morning, you were doing your gym session, before work. And then you go to work. And you might have a stretching session after work. And then the following day, you are back into work. Can you had your field session Tuesday? Wednesday morning was your gym session again before work stretching again that evening. I mean, it had gone from and I'm talking about 2009 we want to two years later. It was such a huge jump from that. And I just couldn't believe but it was it was you were you were you were going even more professional. I mean, we were doing that that team in the naughties that that I that I was part of it was all gone. But I mean, there was there was downtime and there was you know, I won't say it was more relaxed, but there was certainly definitely not as much emphasis on the, the extra bits if you get me. Whereas when I went back in and 11, I was like this is this has gone to a whole new level altogether, even the training, the training itself, the sessions on the field were at an intensity that I I've never experienced before. And so for guys trying to maintain families, you know, young families, in the midst of all that, I just don't know how they did it. My only guess is that they must have very understanding why they just got lucky. But during our time, yeah, it was it was full on, it was full on. And I think I think really, Jonathan, what it was, is that a lot of it was mental, you know, you you could never shut up from it. To get me. You you, I'd be I'd be sitting at my computer at work. And it could be Tuesday at four o'clock. And



we could be playing an A versus B game in a couple of hours time above in the stadium. And all you're thinking about is right. Yeah, I'm probably going to be you know, yourself. Am I going to be on the 18th? Tonight? Maybe not? If I'm on the bees who will be marking me? Probably tomorrow. So she, right? Or am I going to deal with that? What's the best way to get to Mars, if there is a way to get at the most, you know, if you're on if you get it, if the if the team just switched around at half time and you're on the team, what you need to do to, you know, put your hand up and impress. The last thing on your mind is a mortgage application for john and Mary or some of them down the road. You know what I mean? So it was a huge mental thing, and you just couldn't shut off from it, you'd come home. And it would it would dictate your mood, you know, if we hadn't the house built here. So I get home, maybe I live with my parents. And if you were played a good game, or you had a good training session, we'll be straight in for a second room for a cup of tea, which your father your mother and you'd be all chest if you had a stinker, you'd be straight up into your bedroom. The following morning. Exactly. So the mental side of it was massive. The physical side training, the looking after yourself with sessions. And they were tough. But you just knew they were part and parcel of being an intercounty footballer. I mean, it's not. It's not for the good of your health to do what you do. It's, you know, you, you're in there because you love us. But you know, what comes with it in terms of cheese, don't get me, you know, I get sick when I think the winter training sessions and training camps in Portugal, you know, which I'll touch on in a second. But it was the mental side was massive. You just never shut off from it. But no, just going back to the training camps. And it was a running joke at work, you know, or Shawn is up and his because we go and, you know, it used to be a break in the league or there still is a break in the league after the first three games or, you know, maybe you get a two week break. So we usually go for one of those weeks. So which probably was February, February, March, maybe in the February staff match, you know, and the Garrett's work would have the running joke with me or Shawn's off and his his April holiday or his match holiday holiday like you know, and oh my god, it was the last thing. You know, it was the last thing from a holiday. You know, it was it was crazy. It was it was tough core. No, it was brilliant. Because, you know, I look at the Premier League players there and their training sessions when they talk about coming in to do a morning session and an afternoon session. We got to live like a premier league player for a week. You know, you had your you had your own little Villa, you had your your training pitchers. So you might do a morning running session. You have an afternoon work session and you haven't even football session. It was fantastic. But I mean, it was we weren't sitting around on deck chairs, talking about drinking pina coladas, you know. But, you know, great, great times, training was tough. But we knew we knew what we signed up for. And I suppose when you walk away from the end of your career with a couple of islands or whatever, you know, fellows have walked away with four or five medals, all stars, in that it's easy to look back and say, geez, you know, it was whatever it was, you know, you mentioned counties like Claire Langford, Legion, again, no disrespect to those counties just off the top of my head, when you have a guy putting in the same amount as you and they walk away at the end of the season with nothing and probably only get to play a game in the provincial championship and maybe one or two games in the back door if they're lucky, and they walk away with nothing, yet they've put in as much effort. That's when you really ask yourself questions. And what am I doing this for? We were, I suppose, by the grace of God lucky. We were part of it. I carried That you know got to 711 finals in a row just increase it into really but it just we all just happened to come along at the same time and you know that was this the look of the draw in a way I suppose john will drew but yeah you look you came through and what was



I looking back on it seems a bit unique in a way in the fact that obviously there was a huge carry golden generation for one for a better word there like some of the players and even some of the forwards they just literally roll off the tongue in terms of the quality there was unsure but football that coincided with for me kind of the I suppose the eMERGE really of all the teams in Ulster and the fact that they had on unpop what pot is now modern Gaelic football and I suppose it came to the head really in in famous game against Tyrone where it was almost the to the culture culture changes came together and smack Reagan right in the middle and it led to a lot of conversations right? Oh, so you you on the one hand, you have the golden generation on the other hand, you adapt to this new kind of way of playing for want of a better word, it must have been a strange time to be to be involved with that you probably even you talk about the two years how training ingredients crease too much but predictor your role as a half forward? That changed a lot over the years as well I would imagine.



Yeah, absolutely. And I think it was something that certainly like I was on the team in order to win or three as a hat forward and then in all four jack O'Connor came in and he you know, he he was obviously looking in from the outside for last couple years and saw that well maybe Carrie needed to change their attack a little bit. And you know, I probably suffered in a way in that I was more of a stylish you know, expensive wind force explosive wing forward Exactly. That loved going forward and maybe to my own detriment didn't do a whole pile in sorry, didn't didn't do a whole pile in the defensive side of the game maybe and are the inner on the engine room of the game, you know? So obviously jack came in and offered he saw what title and had done to us in 2003 we lost the all Ireland final to our man or tool but I don't think that was down to physical side of it. I just that one that that one that really really resonates with me. I mean, we were four pints up at halftime and I wouldn't say we were in control but we were we were in a good place. I honestly don't know what happened to us in that second half but fair play to where they draw home they got man momentum wasn't I remember like rolling, right? Hidden hidden a massive score from him. That's right,



I think he's about 40 remember rightly at the times, right. And they had those moments of while it was I suppose to start to the defense of transition. I always used to be that team fascinated me that Joe Kernan team the fact that they would drop one back and play with the seven play muggiest as a sweeper and then pretty much a 212 with a with the long diagonal balls going in, but it was still it was still a relatively attacking system. I don't think you can blame the system for your defeat that day. Whereas no turtle and took it to a hell of a lot new levels that found a really difficult attack in famous clip I think we've all seen a million times I think its own browserling is pretty much in front of the the the thing in front of the whole organism. There's about six around him and that's rice. Yeah, just tries to bull through when cat and yeah, a big roar, then. That must have been a strange,



strange game to be involved was it was it was and it was it was it was a real eye opener. But the problem was it was happening in real time. It's not like, you know, and look. It's not like we didn't do any preparation on Taiwan. We knew we knew what they were going to come with. But it was just until it was in your face and the intensity of us, you know, and you had no time to really react. But yeah, so so jack came in and all four and he he said look, we either we're either going to have to change something here or we're going to get left behind and he went for especially around the middle of the field. He went for those type the type of guy who is going to just work your socks off in terms of breaking ball tracking back getting the fellas faces, namely the likes of Paul Galvin, Liam Hassett. You know, and and unfortunately, that left me on the outside looking in, I got I got game time here and there, but it just wasn't in the picture in terms of abstracting and or for you know, and so, yeah, it that that was tough. That was tough to take but You know, I, I was never one to draw the premise out of the class. I was very fortunate that I was in with Carrie and I was trying to help as much as possible. So even though anytime I wasn't starting, I knew I wasn't probably going to see gametime, I try not to leave it affect me in terms of training, I always tried to go in there positive, with a pep in my step and just try and do something during training that, you know, the management might say, you know, General fairplay well done tonight, you know, even if I knew deep down, he wasn't going to have a real bearing when they sat down to pick the first 15, you know, because, and I think that's, that was a lot of why Carrie was successful in that period, you had no matter what number you were on the panel, you just wanted to come in and make sure that you were doing something for the cause. And sulking was going to get, you know, where, and it wasn't going to have a good effect on the group. So I think a lot of guys that would have been down seeing numbers 2122 23 on Match Day, still approach the matches, if you know, what I couldn't be needed at some stage, you know, and I think that really reflected in under the first 15 because they knew that, you know, there was Shawn or Sullivan wasn't overstocking in the corner because he wasn't playing, you know, he'll be ready to go if things aren't going right for me. And I think that was a huge thing that drove us on that time, you know, but certainly, the game changed an awful lot. But the thing about it was that any good team will adapt and we adapt it and Aki Tyrone had our number for a couple years. And we still bounced back and still ended up getting to finals and winning our fair share. Yeah, no



you didn't you I suppose that transition really under under jack O'Connor really kind of brought you back on to the next level where you you did adapt you changed things quite a lot to fit to that being curious to that how did that I suppose change the philosophy go down and carry was because I always strikers carry as the, you know, the home of traditional football players was similar to back home and Galway as well. Was that was that a challenger? Like the guy has done on the street talking? Or did you probably didn't pay much attention to that at



the same time? No, No, we didn't. I mean, when you're in that bubble, Jonathan, you're nuts. You know, I used to go for my lunch break and Killarney from work and of course, you'd have to go meet me on the streets and kick it in kick it should be moving the ball a lot faster. And you know, you know you'd you'd you'd agree with him and walk on you you'd meet a fellow on the other corner who's telling you you should be doing something else. So it's no it didn't affect us once we knew within the group what what we were trying to achieve. And even if you look back, it's not like we went ultra defensive. I mean, there's you couldn't you couldn't go defensive you there was times in a game where you needed to shut up shop and you needed to protect your fullback going or your halfback line or whatever it was. I mean, how could you go defensive when you have, in my opinion, the best forward I've ever played with in column Cooper in one corner, and Johnny Crowley, Derek, Anita. You know, Paul Galvin. Liam Hassocks, these guys debtless salons you couldn't there's no way you could play an overly defensive game when you hit those guys you know, and and even if you go back to the island and finals that we would have lost we were still putting up good scores, you know, just we were we were looking at the D i think the way it's one like I'm not gonna sit here and take away from Toronto Ireland's because you will learn and you will it fair and square in my opinion, but I definitely think the weight one was such in the back it was in the back I know Tyrone ended up running out maybe for the five point winners in the end I think Sean Kevin kept a few beauties towards the end but if you go back earlier in that game pass McConnell makes a great save from Declan I mean, Dickens gone through it's it's got an essay on the corner and don't forget I was warming up actually and I'm thinking this is it this goes in the back of the net we're going to win here and he tips around the post you know, that's small small little margins like in total and pushed down and and ended up winning you know, winning by four or five pints in the end which was deserved but smaller things in games can change them you know, and so by no means were we over broad by title on our defensive systems that you can just ignore three or five and they'd be just on the day and and and how they went about this was their business but you know, barrel three where they weren't overly defensive. I don't think there was much in either game. If you look back on the or five final, which I wasn't involved in, I had been I was traveling that year about and, you know, the weights which were not which I was involved in, there wasn't much indoors games, when you when you tear them up when you when you actually sit down and analyze them like Although there was very, very little between those teams, and I think if you talk to any of the players from those respective teams now, be it from Taiwan or Korea, they'd agree with you that there wasn't a genius on those days, you know,



I guess the Toronto ragley is probably highlighted a lot because it was the culture shock, but what you were kind of at the start of, I suppose, at the end of your career then was kind of coming alongside the rise of what we now know as modern day Dublin. You had some epic battles to yourself. Before you call it a day.



You know, I didn't I didn't come across Dublin. And Ireland was fine. Yeah.



Well, or seven or seven years seven was a humdinger of a game, actually, because we were, we were in pretty much in decent control of that game. Going down the stretch, and I remember coming on pedal shear was our trainer, manager at the time. And we were under a bit of pressure. And he actually said to me, and people don't believe me when I say this, this this is what no word of life. And I often said to pat after I might ask him for the love of numbers, because he said to me, get in, get on the ball. We need a score, whatever it may be, even if it's a punch point is that that's genuinely and I just remember thinking at the time when Why did you say that? You know, but I came on in no way I came into a game where all of a sudden Dublin were we couldn't get out of our own half and Dublin were pegging us back and Penn was back and we we managed to for once sin Steven clocks and don't call a sec I I don't know why I didn't all create the event even enter himself to this day why he decided to go on a solo jaunt off the field. We put him under pressure and we turned it over and it ended up in my arms and I pushed it over the band. So I didn't want that premonition bypass but uh, Nikola Koch actually passed very good Koch. So that would have been seven and then the other only other time I met Dublin and I only came on as a sub again and late in the game was the standard earwig scam that pat Gilroy described to us where we we will give a no chance Yeah, we will give another chance going up and oh nine we should have been knocked out of the championship by slag off first of all entirely and and she'll put us to the pin of our colors in tullamore. And we were coming down on the tree and from tullamore. And we heard we got Dublin and cork Park. And it's as if you flick the light switch. It was straight away. We were going to court Paragon to the bank holiday Monday Actually, we played them. And there was all we needed. You could send them the carriage steady in the train. It was all we need is and we weren't given a chance going up against the dogs. And sure we think the goal scored a goal after 17 seconds. Yes, we're looking office. I I often. And I even tell young fellows know if I'm involved with a team and guys that aren't playing. If you're a sob I said don't be a sob. You know, and I'm sure it's been said to you as well in your playing days. Don't be so don't be a spectator, you know, be ready to go. You know, don't just sit on the bench, you're part of it. It was the one day actually that I just let myself drift off because it was sensational performance like it was in order to be even there to watch us and to be part of it. And I came on and towards the last 10 minutes. It was nice to watch gouache and full flight Darren Sullivan, Mike McCarty, it came back into the setup. Paul Galvin, you know these guys, Declan guys at the top of their game just, you know, tearing Dublin to shreds above underfoot to the front of the hill. You know, it was it was nice. It was nice. Yeah, but so that was the only two times really I came across Dublin but obviously they've they've gone from strength to strength and yeah, it's hard to see. It's hard to see where their dominance is gone. In what look, we have to keep trying, I suppose you know? Yeah. Well, look,



you look back on the the finals from last year, they were both quite close game at the end of the day. It's almost defined really the tie is defined really by that moment of magic, where they just carci a little bit slow, perhaps off the drawing and scored a wonder goal.



The overarching goal is a challenge and



I was wondering how that would be picked up here was that yeah, it will happen quickly put it that way.



Fast. Yeah, it happened fast. No, it was it was one of those things where well, first of all, I think we'd look back at the drawing game as as one we left behind us, you know, you know, even watching it back now as a supporter, you know, down down the stretch of the game. We made silly decisions, turnovers that if we had just returned possession of the ball we were we were alone in champions, you know, are just made better decisions, you know, football decision making Jonathan it's it's a game of decision making and whoever makes the decision the better decisions wins the game too simple as that. Unfortunately, whether it was down to just tiredness or the occasion or our lack of experience, maybe in some cases, we just didn't do enough in the drawing game to see it out. And, you know, going into the replay, we were quite hopeful that, you know, we could we could, we could go again but yeah, that that that was a key moment. All right, right after halftime, of course, you know, they often say that the period before halftime and after halftime was crucial in the game and you know, for Dublin, you know, we had pegged them back I think was level at halftime was this was



close if it wasn't it was close



anyway. Yeah. I think I think it was a draw game. And you know, the force score was a goal. Great finished. Bye bye bye marching. And the last thing you want to give Dublin is that fire that little bit of fire right after halftime, you know, and after that carry, just we're on their heels a little bit, they were chasing the game and you know, you've got to hand it to Dublin they saw they saw through books great experience for all fairness to all Ireland's you know, I particularly think of David Clifford you know, I had the pleasure of coaching David for three years with the development squad down here and you know, everyone doesn't doubt his ability and so on but I suppose in his first dollar and you know, things didn't really go brilliantly for him in the drawing game. And I remember talking to my family after and they were going on about David you know, and I said well, look he he has his our he has his all Ireland played now. You know, he's he's got that first all Ireland out of the way, you know, and now he can look forward to the replay without any of that baggage or any of those hang ups about your first download and etc. Sure, he does. He does support gaming in the replay. I mean, he was he key points for fun so in order for him to get those two islands in his first full year as a senior that can bring him on no end and you know, the other young guys shiny shear these guys been in there for style opens it's out of the way and they don't have to worry about paying their first Ireland anymore. If you get me they can, they can drive on and that's that's where Dublin got over the that's where Dublin got over the line a lot of times, you know, they they had guys, you know, they've gone back to the well all the time that they're getting to these big games playing these big games. And that all stems to a young fella and he brings



Yeah, so obviously you look at you learned a lot from what you're tying you talked about that the long years was your career and how the game has changed and how you've had to change and how have you seen different managers different styles? And you seem like you're very clued in on some I've seen you talk, you know, on the tactical side of the game and how the game works. And then your personal training side as well. But coaching not just the physical body or the mind and experience of your and you've been involved in development camps, you seem to really really admire and fight and like the coaches out of the game as well do.



Yeah, Yeah, I do. I don't think when I came out of the game, the intercounty setup, I never envisaged myself going straight into coaching. I didn't. I didn't, you know, I I thought about it, that it would come maybe later later down the line, but I didn't envisage getting straight into it was around the time I finished up the county board. What kind of re revamping the development squad system in the county x player, Donal Daly, actually, with many good battles that go with Jonathan Dorner was kind of responsible for overseeing the whole the the sports just yet the revamp of it really. I mean, the development squad system was always there, but it it wasn't. I suppose it wasn't taken really seriously. And the results from it weren't visible. You know what I mean? There was no real you know, there was no real end game to it. So he went about just revamping it in his big thing was trying to get x players back involved. And so he asked me what I would I get involved. So basically, To cut a long story short to the counties listen to when it comes to development squads. You have Cary, South and Cary north. And it stacks from under 14, up to under 16. So you're basically trying to develop a pool of players who will, you'd be a carry miner, manager that will be able to pick from when when when he takes off his role, not necessarily that you won't make the carry minors if you're not in a development squad, but it's just a group of players who have come through a system and are there it's a bit like in England, which your youth academy, you know, and so he asked me to get involved, and I did and yeah, I said, I did three years, first of all, and with the same group, so I brought them from 14 to 16. So it would have involved David Clifford's of the world and Michael Potts, guys like this one. Currently inside the senior setup, great guys. So when I finished when they were under 16, I stayed at 16. And I just brought the next few levels through as well. So I did about seven years altogether. But definitely, I think I found my calling in terms of working with young young players, especially there are just there. They're like a sponge, really, Jonathan, you know, they're there. They're mad for information they're mad and how to improve it. And it's very, very easy to motivate them, because all you have to show them is that and let them know is that if they want to commit and if they want to improve, and if they want to work hard on their game, that there could be a Carrie minor. And I suppose it was no coincidence that after Durrell and his team and the county board revamped the squads, along with the great work that was being done in the schools and carry on. And the clubs Of course, that we brought, we brought that feminine and one day alone and in the the minor alone and in 14 and obviously went on to win five and was it fought for more after that and fight five minor overall. Yeah. And it was it was, listen, it's not just down to development squads, and I'm not sitting here taking responsibility for any of that. But what the development squad did was, it prepared these young guys for, you know, where their next step of their career was going. And it brought the level of training up a little bit from what they were receiving in the clubs and the schools. And they were in there with like minded 14 1516 year olds who wanted to be very minor. And you got to live like an intercounty footballer, basically, we are our season goes from January to July, your training once a week at the start, and of course to to as you get near a competition. And you're just working with them. But it's very, I mean, it's it's very well thought out by the comfortable word. I mean, at 14, it's all skill based, you're just trying to prove these guys skills, the competition, at the end of the day is just the reward for the work they have done. At 15, you're going more into



decision making, you know what to do in certain situations. So you're bringing the skills that they had at 14 into decision making. And then at 16, you can get a little bit more, as you mentioned earlier on, you can get a little bit more tactical, you know. And you're very much then in conversation with the carry miner manager of the time, because more often than not, that manager will be picking for loss under six teams in his next year. So you want to develop a certain type of system that when these guys walk into a carry miner setup, that they know what that minor manager expects, and what he wants and the way he wants to play. So there's a lot of open communication between the managers below you and above you, because at the end of the day, you're all working towards one goal, and that's to produce carry footballers. And a big thing I also noticed was he changed the emphasis on the strength and conditioning and lumping. I know a lot of people don't like talking about simply conditioning when it comes to young players 14 1516 I'm not saying we had these guys inside and gyms, Jonathan trying to benchpress 100 you know what I mean? It's they're very tailored to the age and to the, to the ability of the of the young guys and it's all bodyweight until you get to 16 but it certainly stood out for me in terms of watching them developing for juries, and it was great for me to be able to go up to Croke Park and on our large and final day and see these guys that you spend so much time with when and all are the minor metal you know, and I think it'd be gone when one final do they would I be ready?



No no.



What you know is I remember sitting up and obviously you're in early because the minor game is on is on is on early and you're sitting there was nobody around me except two other guys that had been on the management team with me and we're watching these fellows who would come through our hands and do it on the biggest day of their life so far, you know and it's it gives me great satisfaction that you had a small part to play in it sure I mean along with their parents their club trainers their school trainers the carry minor management to brought them to another level but you played some part in this and I'm not with the squads anymore No because I felt I did seven years there and for myself you needed to go in and do something else. But I've I really feel that I've played my small part in in indoors guys going on and achieving an all Ireland minor medal and hopefully hopefully more down the line.



You know when you you're going to be too modest to claim your reward but you obviously did a book a lot of work and while there is a very good structure in place there. Can you compare the two being that your involvement in those minor wins? Compared to winning one of the medal yourself on senior level, or is it a different type of satisfaction?



It's a it's different.



It's different. Yeah. It's it's very different. It's Yeah, it's very different. Like obviously you as a player, it's a very you're part of the team obviously you're part of the squad but in and listen to any player that doesn't say this is going to it's a weird it's a selfish thing as well, if you know you're, of course you won't, you won't you're alone and like, you know, you've you've you've done this, you've put in the hard yards, you know, but you know, obviously you know, I'm a big Liverpool fan, but I saw it think BT Sport did something on the Champions League or European club sorry last night. And he made he I thought he said a lovely thing about the night they won the Champions League against spars. And he said, it's for him when he lifted the cup. And it was great. He knew his feelings when he lifted the trophy himself. But it was what really made it for him was watching his players lift the cup. You know, that's where he got his satisfaction. You know, watching his players celebrate with the trophy. Watching Jordan Henderson run over to his father watching you know, Alison Decker calling his pregnant wife on the iPhone after and for me, anytime those players you know, when I saw them lifting their minor all Ireland are when we want our wants to championship competition in July and I saw these young fellas jumping around the place with a cop. That's the satisfaction you get out of this because you've you've helped them get there. When they had the cop To me, it's great. You lift it and you say yeah, that was great. That that's that's a nice feeling. But you actually feel way better watching them celebrate that's the best way I can describe it. You know?



Very good well listen john electrical you've been an absolute pleasure with your time and give a shout out again to the to the to the to the ranch they are your own business there was a link into here afterwards as well. Yeah, so



I am I on the way over there now actually just to catch up with my with with Jerry and why do I do a little video for you Jonathan just to go to the premises. But uh, so it's SOS personal training. And so I'm on Twitter, Facebook. And really it's it's, it's, it's a real personal service. And it's a one on one or small groups and look, hopefully, hopefully when when everything blows over which which will soon and I can get back at it and get out there. But I appreciate you talking to me today. And thanks for having me. I really enjoyed it.



No absolute pleasure. And we'll let you go thank you so much again, I still haven't forgiven you for that goal and no to By the way, but it was



never even never even talked about it.



I don't know do you think it was it was a great goal that score that day wasn't in my control earlier on in the guest write?






No worries. My pleasure. Thank you so much. I look after



guys, Sean Sullivan from SOS personal training here. Just a quick video to follow on from Jonathan's chat earlier. This is where the magic happens here in the gym. So our little studio where we trade our clients. Just finished a little session there myself. So again, thanks to Jonathan for the chat earlier on really enjoyed us and any queries you can find this was personal training on all the social media platforms. sort of look forward to hearing from you. Thanks, guys.

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